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JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

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Kennedy/Thomas
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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by Kennedy/Thomas » Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:53 pm

gnstill wrote:To confuse matters, the 1906 census in the St Peters Reserve enumerated two different children named Agnes in the household of Mary (nee STEVENS) & William THOMAS (1846-1931); one was his 18 year old daughter Agnes (b-c1888) and the other was his 10 year old (adopted) granddaughter (b-c1896). It was most likely Agnes the adopted granddaughter (child of Juliet & JG KENNEDY) who married in 1917 to Wallace MAYO b-1893.

The fact that granddaughter Agnes was adopted probably indicates that her mother (Juliet) had died before 1906.


1911 Census of Canada recently released to the public is transcribed as follows:
Home / 1911 / Manitoba / Selkirk / 56 Indian Reserve Clandeboye Agency / page 15 unsplit view
Transcribed by: Krystal Tait

43 173 Thomas William M Head M 1851 60 1901
44 173 Thomas Mary Ann F Wife M 1859 52 1901
45 173 Thomas Agnes Matilda F Daughter S 1896 15 1901


I was wondering where the date of birth/life span for William Thomas as 1846-1931 came from; namely the source so I could look it up. In addition I was also wondering where his wife Mary is documented as Mary Stevens. Does any proof of any of the adoptions that William and Mary were involved in exist?

It appears as though William, his wife and kids never got a treaty payment(commutation/annuity) in the St. Peters Settlement-1876 Treaty Census. In recent court cases put into action by Peguis Nation it has been noted that not all Indians who should have been on the lists and/or court documents since the time that the illegal surrender of St. Peters was challenged have been left out of the process. Juliet Thomas's husband John George Kennedy's letter around 1900 regarding his claim to lot 4 and Alexander Kennedy to his claim of lot 19 in around 1910 were both ignored for the most part. They are both deceased now so any recent decisions definitely won't include them on the lists per se.

St. Peters Census-1876 Treaty shows that a William Thomas, wife and kids got nothing for being treaty Indians. This means that they not only got removed from land they probably owned after Chief Peguis assigned it to the family but that they also remained treaty Indians on or off the records.

gnstill
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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by gnstill » Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:45 pm

I have just posted a family page for William THOMAS. Here's the link: WILLIAM THOMAS (1846-1931)

Kennedy/Thomas
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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by Kennedy/Thomas » Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:59 pm

gnstill-Do you consider Alexander Kennedy(b. 1852) a treaty Indian because of the fact that he was born well before 1870 and was heavily associated through his Kennedy relatives to the St. Peters Band? I know that they all helped each other with the paperwork required by the government around this time when many of them would have been filing for returns so to speak. The documented cases are very robust on the Kennedy/Dennet families. After sifting through some of the commutation, scrip and power of attorney papers filed by the Kennedy's it appears that there is a clear and well documented ancestor line from John George Kennedy's maternal side which goes from JG(b. 1870) to his mother Margaret Kennedy(b. 1853) nee Dennet to her mother Margaret Dennet(b. 1823) nee Calder to her mother a Cree woman named Maggie who was married to Marcus Calder.
Unfortunately all these woman did not remain in any single place throughout their lives re they were all born in different places so it would probably therefore be the Kennedy's and mainly Alexander Kennedy's(b. 1852) parents who were present during Treaty 1 in 1870 and to all the amendments made thereafter.
Do you have any background info on this Alexander Kennedy(b. 1852) who was married to Margaret Dennet?

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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by gnstill » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:35 pm

Alexander KENNEDY was a Treaty Indian (St Peters) until he withdrew (was Discharged) in February of 1886 according to my information.

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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by gnstill » Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:18 pm

So far I wasn’t sure who were the parents of Margaret KENNDY b-1853 who married Alex KENNEDY.

Am I correct that you are saying that she was a daughter of Margaret CALDER & William DENNET b-1826? Where did you get that information?

Kennedy/Thomas
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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by Kennedy/Thomas » Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:03 am

I actually thought it was 1827 but I have accepted that it could reasonably range within a couple years either way based on the way some census takers were a bit to eager to get the list well before it got published. Such is the case where it is stated on the census that the said person will be of such and such an age upon their next birthday and the fact that many affidavits presume that the affected person(s) in the affidavit were telling the truth that they were around or about such and such an age. It says born 1827 on scrip claim numbered 12256 but done on a form that matches other affidavits at the time. I am learned that the forms used for the Indians and Metis of the time vary considerably but all tell the same story of what happened. Here again as with other people we study Sr. and Jr. are used in a confusing manner and in the case of the Kennedy's and Thomas's to an extent the applications use the married name of the woman and then list their parents with completely different names since the woman got married and took her husband's name which was a good way to lose your status back then and made it easier to accept any losses the gov't incurred due to fraudulent claims-it all averaged out much like the adjusted compensation for Peguis nation in recent years accounting for not much more than breaking even. Why play these games in the first place. It reminds me of how the Churches first thought they didn't have to cooperate with residential school investigations into their priests but later decided to release records after realizing that it was all wrong from the start.

Kennedy/Thomas
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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by Kennedy/Thomas » Mon May 07, 2012 1:22 am

Margaret Kennedy nee Dennet put in a power of attorney giving her husband Alexander Kennedy the ability to act on her behalf and he subsequently got a lawyer to represent them. The claim for scrip put in by the law firm stated that her parents were William Dennet and Margaret Calder. There is a ref. no. HB 4159 for her accounting slip showing she got $160.00 which was attached to scrip no. 4306. The year in question for he paperwork was 1886 when it was processed.

To follow up on the parents of Margaret Kennedy(b. about 1853) as per census records she was the daughter of William Dennet(b. 1827) based on his Dominion of Canada-Province of Manitoba document on which he signed his name before or after it was stated that he was born on or about the year 1827 in St. Andrews. His parents are listed as William Dennet, a white man and Sophia Ballendine, a halfbreed. Maybe Sophia was pure Indian because she is described as an Indian woman in church registrars as per genealogist Gail Morin. William might have said she was Metis in order to get his scrip but who knows for sure. William also stated that it was scrip for he and his family implying that he was already married so who could this wife be? There is a scrip document for a Margaret Dennet nee Calder in the same year. William's document was claim no. 2823 and Margaret's was claim no. 2822 so they probably went and got their scrip papers at the same time because they were married. Margaret's father is listed as a Marcus Calder and her mother as a Maggie-Cree woman without another last name given.

There is a nice website with a backgrounder on William Dennet(b. 1780 in Ronaldsay, Orkney Islands, Scotland) who was William Dennet's, born 1827, father. William and Sophia Ballendine(b. 1791/2) were William's parents. The link is www.todd-genealogy.ca.

The Glenbow Museum's Charles Denney collection has a file on Marcus Calder and Maggie that can be consulted along with a file for William Dennet and Sophia Bellendine.

As for as Alexander Kennedy(b. actually 1847 on his power of attorney papers) and not 1852-1854 as for other sources, his parents are listed as Baptiste Kennedy and a Margaret Sinclair I estimate were both born right around 1827 making them 20 years old or so before they starting having kids. In 1885-6 this Kennedy family left the St. Peters Band after finalizing their commutation and scrip claims with the Clandeboye Agency administering the Indian Act for St. Peters Reserve. I have no idea who Baptiste was other than that he might have had a name change and could have been absent for long periods of time while serving as a guide up and down the Red River at a time when maybe monogamy wasn't crucial to a good marriage. The Indian agent(s) at the time had a list of Alexander's kids and John George is listed along with his known siblings less the oldest who would have been discharged as an adult over 18 years of age as of 1885-6.

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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by gnstill » Mon May 07, 2012 7:58 am

We seem to be jumping around and around; I’m getting dizzy again. I like to tackle/solve one family or topic at a time. I fully agree with what you are saying about Margaret DENNET & Alex KENNDEY b-1853. I have similar information supporting all that; no problem there.
However, I would like to concentrate on Margaret DENNET herself. You seem to be basing her parentage solely on a census record. What census record(s) are you referring to? If it is the 1891 census, I have problems with that which I can explain.

Kennedy/Thomas
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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by Kennedy/Thomas » Mon May 07, 2012 1:42 pm

The Margaret Dennet in the 1891 census must have been born a Dennet to a William Dennet and his wife Elizabeth something. The Margaret Dennet's who I am referring to both used their married surnames, Kennedy and Calder respectfully, to apply for scrip. I have no idea who this 19 year old Margaret Dennet in the 1891 census was but it would nice to know who she was. It would also be nice to know who Baptiste Kennedy born around 1827, the father of Alexander Kennedy(born 1847-1852) was.

The married Margaret Kennedy born as Margaret Dennet(1853) who applied for scrip by using a power of attorney and her brother Gilbert who has the same parents based on his scrip records available at the Metis Nation Database website vouched for her identity and right to receive scrip.

The married Margaret Dennet born as Margaret Calder(1823) applied for scrip from what it looks like at the same time as her husband William Dennet(b. 1823-27). This Margaret had a brother James Calder who had the same parents as her. I believe his scrip papers are also available on the Metis Nation Database website.

gnstill
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Re: JOHN GEORGE KENNEDY (1870-?)

Post by gnstill » Tue May 08, 2012 8:04 pm

I will be posting more KENNEDY family pages in the next few days that should help us sort some of this out. Stay tuned Kennedy/ Thomas.

By the way, you can call me Gary and I wish I had a short name that I could refer to you by; you still haven't even told us whether you are male or female?

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